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SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Did the President bother to explain to you where he got the P500 million?

MS. OCAMPO: No, he did not talk.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: He did not bother to say, "These are my excess campaign contributions that corporate executives gave to me after I bacame President."

MS. OCAMPO: No.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: No, he never did. He didn't say, "These are prospective campaign contributions that corporate executives are giving to me for the May 2001 elections." He never did?

MS. OCAMPO: No, Ma'am.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: He just signed in silence.

Well, let me go to a more legal point. According to you, this IMA, Investment Management Agreement was signed on 3 February or about that period.

MS. OCAMPO: February 4.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: I would like to read to you a circular of the Bangko Sentral Governor, Circular No. 251, series of 2000. I will presume that you have knowledge but if not, it's no denigration of your capacity as a witness. This circular says:

Unless otherwise prescribed under laws, anonymous account or accounts under fictitious names should not be kept or allowed.

That is paragraph 3 of this circular.

Paragraph 6 says, among other things:

If there is reasonable ground to believe that the funds are proceeds of a criminal or other illegal activity, they should be reported to competent authority without violating any law. If the fund is held as deposit, the account should be closed.

Now, according to you, Mrs. Witness, you signed this document according to your version, together with the President on February 3. It is now nearly a year from that day. In that intervening period between the time you signed the document and today, did you make any attempt to comply with the provisions of this circular that I have just read?

MS. OCAMPO: This is the account of the Chairman of the Board, so I--

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Please just be responsive to the question. That's legal language, so please come to the point. Yes or no?

MS. OCAMPO: Did I? Did I? No.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Right. This circular says, "if there is a reasonable ground to believe that the funds are proceeds of a criminal or other illegal activity, they should be reported to competent authority without violating any law," meaning to say, the Secrecy of Bank Deposits law. "If the fund is held as deposit, the account should be closed."

What I want to know is: "Did you take any step to implement this provision of the Bangko Sentral Circular I have just read?

MS. OCAMPO: No, Ma'am.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: No, Thank you. That's pretty straightforward.

Now, let's go to December 11 or was it 13, when you said you went to the office of Atty. Mendoza and you met there Jaime Dichaves and a few other people, because Jaime Dichaves was willing to accept a Deed of Assignment over this controversial account. That would be - would that be correct?

MS. OCAMPO: Yes. We were going to implement the instructions of the principal who was willing to assign his interest to Jaime Dichaves.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: That is right, you are perfectly correct there. Thank you.

According to you - let me just check this day. This was December 11, 2000, isn't that so?

MS. OCAMPO: Eleven and 13.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Right, 11 and 13. And during that time, was the resign-or-impeach-Erap movement already under way to your best knowledge?

MS. OCAMPO: Yes.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: It was already under way?

MS. OCAMPO: It was already-Oo.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: All right. There were already sectors of our society saying, "Don't even bother to impeach him, force him to resign." And there were some who said, "No, let's give him a chance to defend himself. Let's impeach him and make him undergo trial." This was during December 11 to 13, isn't that so?

MS. OCAMPO: Oo.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: And when you had this meeting in the office of Atty. Mendoza, there was a man, Jaime Dichaves who, in effect, was willing to take the rap for President Estrada. Assuming that your version is correct, that the real owner of this controversial account is President Estrada, here was a man who was willing to assume ownership of the money even if it came with a big cloud of legal doubt over it. Would that be a fair statement?

MS. OCAMPO: I don't really know what his intentions were. It was between him and the President, I suppose.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: All right. So in other words, you are perfectly within your rights to express your opinion in that way because we want transparency here. So in other words, December 11 to 13, 2000, just a month ago when the campaign to remove the President was already gaining ground, when the ball was already rolling, a person wanted to accept a Deed of Assignment which, in effect, in my view, would have taken the heat off the President because there was a man who was willing to be a fall guy and yet, the President, according to you did not sign the Deed of Assignment. Is that correct?

MS. OCAMPO: There was no Deed of Assignment presented.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: The President refused because the Deed of Assignment never reached the bank and that's why the document, the transaction was not finalized?

MS. OCAMPO: Yes, Ma'am.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Right. So the President refused to let a fall guy take the rap if that is the view?

Audience, this is not entertainment. This is a legal proceeding. I will have to request the Chief Justice to give just one final warning to the audience.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER: The public is directed again to observe faithfully the rules to preserve precisely the dignity of the Impeachment Court.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: This has been repeated many times. If you are asking for a law in our society, may I remind you, the Senator-Judge, you should be the first to observe that law.

Let me proceed because I am under a time limit.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER: You may proceed.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Presumably this Investment Management Agreement or what you have clarified to be a contract of agency has not been terminated?

MS. OCAMPO: Yes, Ma'am.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Even at the very height of the movement to remove President Estrada before the expiration of his official term of office for which he was elected by a historic majority, even at that very height, this account has not been closed?

MS. OCAMPO: We are just an agent. It is still active.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: That is right. It is just a factual question. This account is still active.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER: The attention of Her Honor is now directed to the time limit.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO: Oh, I am very sorry. I have already exceeded my limit. All right, thank you very much.

x x x x x

THE PRESIDING OFFICER: Senator-Judge Sotto.

SEN. SOTTO: I may waive my other questions. I just have some layman questions, Mr. Chief Justice, if I may be allowed?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER: Senator-Judge Sotto.

SEN. SOTTO: Ms. Witness, you came out into the open on this on December 21? You went to talk to the Prosecutors on December 21?

MS. OCAMPO: I went to management. That was earlier. Then we discussed whether I would go ahead. And management actually talked to counsel and the Prosecution.

SEN. SOTTO: When you say "management", was that President George Go? George Go management?

MS. OCAMPO: The President of the bank.

SEN. SOTTO: George Go?

MS. OCAMPO: No, he is the chairman. Mr. Wilfredo Vergara.

SEN. SOTTO: I understand that Mr. George Go resigned or left the bank?

MS. OCAMPO: As Chairman of the Board.

SEN. SOTTO: When?

MS. OCAMPO: December 12.

SEN. SOTTO: Oh, after or before you came out into the open. And who was the new President who replaced George Go?

MS. OCAMPO: Atty. Romulo.

SEN. SOTTO: Atty. Romulo is the new bank president.

MS. OCAMPO: Ricardo Romulo, chairman of the bank.

SEN. SOTTO: Chairman. The same Atty. Romulo who is president of the Makati Business Club?

MS. OCAMPO: Yes.

SEN. SOTTO: Is he related to the Romulo Law Office--

MS. OCAMPO: Yes, Your Honor.

SEN. SOTTO: --that is handling prosecution?

MS. OCAMPO: Yes.

SEN. SOTTO: Thank you.

x x x x x

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